myopic pilgrim

Stumbling my way to where I think Jesus is

1. kenny 9.3.08 / 11pm

   There’re two things I think you’re looking for which aren’t explicitly identified here, both of which seem good to me: 1) authenticity; 2) quality.

   To me, the biggest issue is the quality. Most of the mass produced worship stuff is just pretty thin on real, worship-inspiring content. I think if the content were really great, there would be less concern with everybody singing the same stuff; after all, there’s a reason everybody’s heard of Shakespeare.

   As for the authenticity, I’d think this would be more about honesty rather than region. What’s startling about the Psalms is how often they will say something like ‘my sins are up to my head’ or ‘my God, my God, why have you forsaken me?’ What’s often disheartening for me about contemporary worship is the two-dimensionality of the worship, this cookie-cut ‘everything’s great because of God’ kind of forced cheerful militancy. When I show up at church heavy laden with my real concerns, my sins and the serious problems of my life, I’d love to be able to sing about these things.

   As for a worship band having its own sound, that sounds great, if a tall order, if you have the worship leader who has the artistry to develop this (and, I think CD does have this).
2. nate 9.4.08 / 1am

   I agree with Kenny – though I’ve come to hate the word “authentic” in a church context. You can also put the “relevant” in that bucket too, but I digress.

   So I agree with Kenny but I think there is contradiction for most churches who would like to create a unique sound. I think you hit on it when you said that you could go to any other church and find familiarity. Most churches, while purporting to focus on drawing the unchurched, usually feel they need to be worshiping to the hits of today’s christian radio.

   I believe it’s because they look at other churches and want to compete for market share and are afraid to miss out on being hip…..ooh, and relevant!

   Another theory I muse on, is based on the reality that many given congregations are more interested in singing their favorite tunes on Sunday than learning a [your church name here] original.

   Perhaps it’s an indicator that most believers feel more connected to the our culture of church and faith than to his/her direct church family? Could explain why core-member retention is usually in the 20-30% while rest of the “committed” church-goers move from congregation to congregation.

   Most church shoppers consider the music to be a big part of why they stay. For churches who know they risk retention through boring children/youth ministries, a too traditional (or too progressive) preacher, etc….. worship becomes the easy slam dunk if you stick to the hits. And too much is riding on the church success to mess with the worship.

   This is why churches will even resort to the multi-genre worship services. Of course there are no decent jazz services – which is why I stopped going….haha.
3. nate 9.4.08 / 1am

   By multi-genre, I refer to “first service is hyms, second service is “contemporary, third service is ‘rock-out’”.

   You should check out http://www.evbc.org

   Go to the visitors link – strategically placed in the top left corner.

   Then on the far right click on “service styles”.

   Take a second to read the descriptions of the three styles: Live, Unplugged, and Six.

   I’ve been to six – it was a fun concert…wall of sound, lighting, and not much substance all around….entertaining though!
4. jos' 9.4.08 / 2pm

   Kenny, I realize that somewhere in there I was asking for two things that could be in mutually exclusive, a regional sound and local church sound. And I’m definitely for having songs that bind local churches to one another.

   So I think you might be right as far authenticity goes, which for Nate’s sake I’m going to define as asking the questions, “Is this us? Is this real?” When we’re reaching for quality I’m constantly asking if we’re trying too hard. Lyrically and musically, are we asking too much of the congregation? If my job is effectively lead a congregation in worship, shouldn’t I stick to what “works.”

   Which leads me to some of Nate’s comments. I don’t know how widespread the desire to gain market share is in evangelical churches, but I’m sure that’s out there somewhere. I think it’s more closely related to the difficulty local bands have. Really, people want to hear the Top 40 covers that they already know and love and not so much the original ballad penned by the lead singer.

   A good cover band (and really isn’t that what worship team is) will be more quickly accepted than a crew that just does original tunes. In the long run however the band who does originals will have its own identity.

   If they can, you know, last that long before caving in and playing “Sweet Home Alabama.”
5. kenny 9.5.08 / 12pm

   That’s a really interesting comment Nate made about most Christians identifying more with our ‘culture of church.’ I think that’s really true; but I’m not sure if that’s good or bad. It really is just like the Starbucks thing; it’s nice to be able to go almost anywhere and feel its familiarity, but surely certain things are lost too.

   Another thing I wonder about is whether it’s worth straining against the culture. We live in a world where the media and the market carry certain things, whether songs or coffee, to every corner of the globe, and in the process homogenize those things. Can this really be resisted? And is it so bad?

   I’d think the pragmatic approach would be for a worship leader to mix the Top 40 with his own songs, so you give people enough of the familiar to feel comfortable, and then use that comfort to expose them to something more personal to the locality.
6. kenny 9.5.08 / 12pm

   I hate hearing about authenticity too, but I’m trying to be nicer to postmoderns.
7. jos' 9.5.08 / 9pm

   Balance is the answer. Again.

   Thanks for being a part of this conversation. I really appreciate fellow pilgrims on this journey to discover an authentic and relevant meta-narrative.
8. nate 9.7.08 / 1am

   hehe…nicely done, Jos’

   Here’s another question that I really don’t know the answer to, but should, argh (more on that in a sec**):

   What is worship like at Matt Redman’s, or Chris Tomlin’s etc. church?

   These guys write the big hits…..do they play exclusively originals or mix in Shout to the Lord once in a while. My guess is the latter…suggesting that a balance and acceptance of homogenization is appropriate. But maybe then, as said above, a church should strive for their region’s sound. That’s harder to come by in say, Reno, then New Orleans but it should still be a goal. Maybe in the end it sucks that most regional churches feel they don’t have an identifiable culture to grasp?

   Churches often lack connection with each other. Even if CD were to create something unique, it be unlikely to spread that sound through the community of churches….they are too connected with KLOVE and therefore too busy trying to emulate vs. recreate.

   **So it turns out that for the last several years Chris Tomlin has been officially leading worship here in Austin at a church he helped plant 15 mins from my house.

   I found this out 2 weeks after he “and his band” left to plant a church in Atlanta with Louie Giglio. So yeah, I should have been able to answer the question above if I weren’t a moron. ah well.
9. nate 9.7.08 / 2am

   In the end……all worship leaders should just do their best to move away from coffee house rock and Coldplay.

   Gospel (of the R&B flavor) were early adopters of full instrumentation in worship. Why has this not caught on – in predominantly white churches. Shame on KLOVE, hehe.

   There’s a brilliant example in the song Friend of God written by Israel Houghton. Compare the two versions:

   By Israel Houghton (be sure to listen through the intro) – a great reminder that choirs can be very relevant too!
   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ty0SO7IvtXM&feature=related

   By Chris Tomlin
   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2MSUrVfHuM4&feature=related
10. kenny 9.8.08 / 10am

    I had a conversation with my worship leader here about this topic, and she made an interesting comment. She said she writes worship music, but has never used it. She feels uncertain whether she is capable of defining the congregation’s worship, and for that reason generally returns to classic, retuned hymns instead of playing her own music for the congregation.
11. smlwoman 9.9.08 / 10am

    Off topic, but I didn’t realize how cute Chris Tomlin was.
12. jose 9.10.08 / 12pm

    Nate, it’s unlikely for the “Coram Deo Sound!” to permeate Christendom, but stuff like that happens. The UK worship scene (e.g. Matt Redman, Delirous?) was pretty popular a few years ago.
    Hillsong out of Australia not only includes Shout to the Lord, but their youth group, Hillsong United.
    Israel Houghton definitely has some play.
    The Passion Movement that includes those Texas boys, Chris Tomlin, David Crowder, and Charlie Hall (okay, Hall is from Oklahoma).

    So anyway, it happens to varying degrees, but export wasn’t really the point.
13. jose 9.10.08 / 1pm

    Nate, also yes, the coffeehouse rock… acoustic guitar-driven rock/pop like Matchbox 20. While it’s a great sound and lends itself to sing-alongs, it gets tired.
    I don’t hear much Coldplay-like stuff, but maybe we’re thinking two different things. Personall, I wouldn’t mind a little more stuff like that or Keane.

    I think I’ll write a little review of Christian musicians pushing the boundaries of mainstream worship music, lyrically and musically.
14. jose 9.10.08 / 1pm

    Kenny, that’s interesting she feels like she couldn’t define her church’s worship. I want to tell her that it’s her job as an artist of the Church to express the truths of Church. But she’s already doing that, isn’t she? She’s just not sharing it with her local congregation.

    On the other hand, there will be songs that I write that are worship and true, but not necessarily for my church. I’d have to take into account what my church is and how she worships.
15. jose 9.10.08 / 1pm

    Jody, he’s got the dreamiest smile, but he’s got nothing on Smitty’s eyes. It doesn’t hurt to be pretty I guess. Can you imagine what kind of attractive power he has when he’s holding a guitar?

    Again off the subject, but I fear the “moral lapses” of senior pastors are matched only by worship leaders.
16. kenny 9.14.08 / 10pm

    I’m not sure if I conveyed this clearly about my Lincoln worship leader, but she said she was uncertain whether she could define the scope of worship for our congregation when she compared her vision and knowledge with that of classic hymn writers; she mentioned Martin Luther, for example.

    But I also felt like saying to her, ‘well, Martin Luther was just a human being like you, and there’s no reason to assume your light is duller than his, or, at the very least that the light God has seen fit to give you as a leader isn’t adequate to the task God has given you.’
17. jos' 9.15.08 / 1pm

    I’ve never felt that. But then I compare with today’s hot songwriters, not the giants of previous generations.

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